I think this is a good idea (the group, the "standards"), but it mustn't be strict : I mean we don't need standards for everything, (see Windows...), let us see ti-programming as alternative computing.
Multitasking is also a good idea, but we need to define the capabilities of this OS: we must deal with efficiency, speed, and all that.
I've a TI82, but i'm very interested in the 92 too, because i known 68Kasm, so i think i can help a little bit.

p.s. sorry, i don't speak english every day,so...

well everyone already helps eachother out in the ticalc forrums, there are plenty of good FAQs, tutorials, etc written by good ppl.

I've found the z80 the easiest and most enjoyable language to learn just because theres lots of ppl in the ti community who are happy to spend some of their time to help beginners.

So my point is, why should ppl be in a restricted programming enviroment to make the best software, when all the information you can possibly want is already available?

To round off, teamwork is great, thats because ppl share the work. If i write a program in your TI alliance, will i get other ppl to help me improve it? add to it? fix bugs? just because i'm in the alliance? nah. If you want teamwork, advertise on ti-philes under PUDs, you might get some ppl willing to help there.

I think that is very unfeasible. That would be very good, but it will never happen. Also, plug in technology has already been accomplished by myself in Ti Word 98, which was written in basic. So plug ins don't need to be done by a group of people. As for the OS, Usgard is compatible with all ZShell, so there isn't any problem there. Bug free programs, maybe. I think working in large groups isn't very good. Every programmer has there own style of coding, so you would have programs with a ton of different coding styles. The only good thing would be the shared variables.

I liked the concept someone mentioned of dev.ticalc.org (or at least having a developper's section.) As opposed to having large numbers of people working on programs, however, maybe a section could be made on that developpers' site that would be called Bug Central or something. Basically, it could be a place where people report bugs in calculator programs and other people might offer suggestions on how to fix the code. This way, the author would be alerted to problems in the code and work-arounds, but would not necessarily be forced to implement these workarounds in someone elses' style. Basically this would really just give the authors more awareness of problems in their code. It would still be their responsibility to update the program. Maybe a web page could be made for porting programs and a TiCalc team of volunteers would port different things over to different calculators. Programming info, of course, could be added to the developpers area. It does exist now on TiCalc, but if say, Dux Gregis or Dan Eble pitched in and sent all their info in, it would become a lot more robust. Someone suggested a common database of requested variable names, memory locations, etc. I think that's an excellent idea. Also, if emulation (on calc & off) information such as program compatibility issues were added to the site, it would be pretty neat. But I digress. This solution would encourage and aid programmers in fixing up their programs. It would also serve as a central location from which people could learn assembly. OK, i've been up for 72 hrs now, so forgive my rambling incoherent excuse for a post.

I think you have the best of the ideas presented here. I mean, an alliance sounds good in theory, but like other people have said, many programmers has a DIRECT correspondence with many bugs. That is the way it is. And, while a standard interface and function set would be good, and there are many merits, like someone else said, when a program doesnt use some of the functions, they just take up valuable space. With the E2, some function switching can occur, using memory swapping, but so far, this is in its development stages with a ways to go (for the ti-85).

So, what this guy said, (the one I am replying to) about the dev.ticalc.org thing idea, is a very good idea. bugs can be reported, ideas for solving them, and the programmer can fix them if he wants, how he wants. A lot of programmers are secretive of there code, and so would probly liek this idea better than just letting everyone have access to it, or whatever. I don't know how this could be exaclty implemented, but it should be tried. Perhaps a section that gives you a list of the programs on ticalc and then under each you can post a bug, or an idea for improvement, a general comment, etc. I don't know how the sysops would want to do this on the server side, but im sure it could be implemented without too much trouble.

Well, this is my humble opinion, which I hope people have ideas about to make it better.

i have told almost everyone on this earth that Plexus Publishing will convert(or at least try) programs for FREE FREE FREE. all anybody says is "cool" i havent recieved one order so why dont u check it out click on the link above

Well, this idea is both good and bad, it has some pluses and minuses. I think a part of Ti-Calc or maybe and independent website with some sort of info sharing would be a good idea. In other words a page with diff. subjects concerning different aspects in asm programing and people with ideas on how do improve those aspects. Almost a sort of message board were people can share new idea's and then link to there programs source code. Also if someone included in this page a place were nonprogramers could submit idea's for games that they cannot make, but think that they would be good. Sort of a big online data base with ideas and people communicating with each other and sharing idea's, with chat rooms, message boards, and such. This would be much better then a non-flexable alliance were before you do anything you have to ask everyone else.

Hope someone agree's with me. :)

I'll create a Ti programing alliance, and any one who wants to join should e-mail me. I'll e-mail u back and say ok. Any Ti calc programing experance is welcome.
Laine Walker
LaineW@technologist.com

I'm sure that you have all heard the saying "you don't get something for nothing" (or something to that effect). What do you expect of free software? If you want first class bug-free software that does more than one little function you might just have to pay for it. Personally I am sitting on dozens of mind boggling programs for math and science which I haven't released. I'm not crazy enough to give away good free software.
Although I do have plans to release a software site where demos can be downloaded, and you can buy the full versions I personally don't have the time to oversee such a large task. Which leads to the idea of a "publishing house" for software. They pick which programs are good enough, provide the web site, write the help files to go with the program, and other operation tasks. For this the publishing house would get a cut of the cost of the software. Lets face it folks, if you want good software it is worth $3-5.

I remember that one program (I think it was McMik) was shareware and asked a meager $1 for the full version. I don't think they got too many registrations, so ultimately paying for Calculator games/programs has been viewed as a failure. This is more of a hobby than an enterprise. It looks good on a resume and gives you programming experience, but I don't think people are going to get too rich off of it.

I would, however, suggest that a Programmers' fund be organized. Money could be donated by loyal TiCalc fans, and calculators could be sold to programmers (chosen or voted for by TiCalc) at very reduced prices (like 40-70% off.) This would give programmers more access to other calculators.

Come on. Let's face it, the idea of charging for calc programs isn't going to happen. TI has made great steps with their Flash ROM, but for 82-86 & 92 you will be hard-pressed to find anyone who will pay for programs. This page is stocked with great programs, and it is faily unlikely that something so amazing will be developed that people are going to run out and spend money on it. If these "amazing programs" you are sitting on are really so great, how about releasing a couple so people can judge for themselves?

I would wager that if the very best programmers got together and made gameboy quality games (better than anything currently available), people would be willing to pay, say, $10 to $15. Why not, they payed $50 for the same programs on gameboy? Screen shots and good names would be enough to sell the games.
Part of the problem is that registration fees have to be mailed in. If programs were registered for and paid for over the internet by credit card, I think that people would subscribe.
Hell, if programmers were getting paid by an actual tax paying business (alliance), you might even be able to call them *employed* -- capable of turning out quality games in short periods of time.

There is however one problem with paying for games. One person would buy it then they would distribute it freely.

I know what you mean.... I've considered trying either a password feature or something, but I just can't figure out how to make 'em pay...... so I say don't charge, just sit back and do this stuff for fun.....
sorry if this is what every1 else said..... I've had a long day

On the 86 (I don't know about other calcs but I would assume that the 83 and 89 have it too) there is RAM location called _calc_id. I haven't really looked at it, but I would assume that there is some unique correlation between this number and the number on the back of the calc. It's theoretically possible for there to be a cgi that inputs the number on the back of the calc and outputs a program that can only be run on that calc.

I'd like to add that a company with the kind of orginzation that I mentioned before might be able to cooperate with TI, it's members each possessing a copy of their ROM's source code and other assets that couldn't be obtained by a lone programmer.

you could probably edit the program in a hex editor to change the id nubmer.

But in order to get to RAM it has to come from ROM.

I'm still not sure that I understand Microsoft's source of revenue, as few of their programs cost end users any money, but as I understand it, they provide programs to the PC makers, which makes the PCs more valuables to consumers, which allows the PC makers to charge more for the PC, and much of that money is passed on to Microsoft. In this system, Microsoft does not have to worry about end users pirating software, since it's free to those users, and the PC makers can't pirate the software because they are too conspicious. If you have a really incredible program that makes a TI-xx much more valuable to TI, you might be able to work out a similar deal. Of course, this would not be very feasible for run of the mill programs that are cool but don't add much value to a TI-xx, but hey, it's worth a shot.

Do you really think anyone would pay $10 or $15 dollars for a CALCULATOR program? McMik was (is) a great game, and was very fun to play, but read the other comment; 1 little dollar was asked for the full version and nobody really bought it. Also, the problem with duplicating gameboy games is that it would be extremely hard for the calculator to duplicate the graphics or the speed. (OK, so the processors are the same on the TI-8x calculators as on the gameboy, but I've seen games on the gameboy fly that crawl on the calculator. Besides, the screen resolution is so low on caclculators in comparison to the gameboy that it isn't even funny. So any really good graphical games would be extremely hard if not impossible to make for the cacluator that would be up to par with the gameboy.)
I am sorry, that was way of topic, but I felt it had to be mentioned.

The quality of a game, whether on a gamboy or on a calc, completely depends on the skill of the programmer(s). The TI-89 is certainly capable of housing games twice as fast and graphicly as good as any gameboy game. The 86 could be programmed to be faster (8x z80 is 2 MHz faster than the gameboy z80) than gameboy games; with grayscale graphics you have an alright game. The problem is the lack of truely excellent programmers.

Profiteering in the Ti-community will never work.
Here are some reasons why:

1) Not that $5 is a great deal to pay for a high quality game, but the fun of Ti-calcs is that you dont have to pay anything for them, and accessing the programs requires little effort

2) Ever heard of Warez... Well since none of this enterprise would be *truly* official, then there would be no means of attacking warez ti-games

3) Other good programmers would be against charging money, thus leading the public to have only their free games which are almost comprable to the ones for sale

4) Remember the Kirk Meyer vs. Monopoly fiasco? Think of how much of a fuss they would raise if he was selling the game.

5) I really would rather see the ti-community helping each other, rather than restricting its domain via supply/demand