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CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Posted by Michael on 9 December 2004, 18:42 GMT

[CrunchyOS]Dan Weiss has released v0.6 of his 83+ flash application shell CrunchyOS. New in this version is the CrunchyOS Builder which allows ASM programs to be packed into the app, thus saving space. Compatibility with MirageOS programs is also improved.

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Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andy Janata  Account Info
(Web Page)

How much free space is in the app? If the page is over half free, I'd seriously consider using it on at least one of my calculators. Even if I can only fit one big game in it, that'd be nice.

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 18:54 GMT


Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Michael Vincent  Account Info
(Web Page)

There's a binary file in the zip that's 7,138 bytes. Therefore I would assume you have about 8,000 more bytes for storage.

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 18:58 GMT

Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
MissingIntellect  Account Info
(Web Page)

Wow, you've really been on top posting news, Michael. I'd thought about applying for a position, but it's unneded. ;)

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 19:15 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Morgan Davies  Account Info
(Web Page)

He has been doing an *awesome* job since the day he started!

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 23:02 GMT


Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andree Chea  Account Info

Can CrunchyOS be compiled to be MORE than 1 page?

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 19:47 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
calkfreak83  Account Info
(Web Page)

Oh, dude... that would mean like way more space to put games into it with... there should be a vote or something on it... I vote for 2 pages (or more =).)

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 22:08 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andy Janata  Account Info
(Web Page)

That'd just be a waste of space, IMO. It probably has a table of all the stuff in it, and unless that table is smaller than the corresponding VAT entires for the programs, it'd be wasteful.

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 22:20 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Michael Vincent  Account Info
(Web Page)

Right. It's taking advantage of the fact that an app is a minimum of 16 KB, regardless of its size. Once you've reached 16 KB it's absolutely foolish and limiting to store programs in apps.

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 23:29 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
DWedit  Account Info
(Web Page)

Archived programs still take up a small amount of RAM. If you have a TI83+ Silver Editon or similar calc, the VAT entries for all the archived programs may take up enough ram to stop the biggest games from running. By sticking the 'VAT Entries' into a table inside the app, you use up less RAM.

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 01:51 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andy Janata  Account Info
(Web Page)

Yes, but I still don't see the point of making the App larger than one page to store more programs... Perhaps it would be smart to actually stick more smaller progams inside it than just one or two large ones.

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 17:17 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
DWedit  Account Info
(Web Page)

Yes. You can use as many pages as you want, limited only by your total archive size.

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 03:05 GMT

Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Rodney Blythe  Account Info
(Web Page)

Crunchy OS is great! (Thats why I voted for it) The original version was great, so I am sure this version will be even better. :)

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 19:49 GMT

Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
CalcKing  Account Info

Because MirageOS 1.3 will have program compression, and has an option to prevent archive writeback, I doubt I will ever use CrunchyOS. I don't care about highscores at all.
Looking at the readme, it seems like the author put a lot of work into this shell, but I still prefer MirageOS. I don't know when 1.3 will be released in final form, but I hope it will be soon!

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 20:18 GMT

Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andree Chea  Account Info

Is the compression the same type? I've read @DS that it uses Lite8x, not pucrunch. And will it require 2x the RAM of the original file to decompress (like Omnicalc)?

Hehe, I sometimes use CrunchyOS to run my hidden MOS programs (because I use an un-user-friendly GUI) :)

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 20:45 GMT

Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Jason Malinowski  Account Info

I believe the requirement for the memory was so Omnicalc didn't crash MirageOS. Since it will be integrated, MirageOS should be able to decompress right from flash. Of course, I can't say, I'm just speculating.

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 23:08 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Michael Vincent  Account Info
(Web Page)

You are correct.

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 23:32 GMT

Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
W Hibdon  Account Info
(Web Page)

So you telling me that hiding in MOS no longer f's up my calc? Because in version 1.0, I lost about three calcs to it, and I was not about to test it on my latest one. However, it is good to know.

-W-

Reply to this comment    10 December 2004, 02:18 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
anykey  Account Info

Yep. It'll now run basic programs without crashing, too; but I have noticed that it skips certain loops in my basic programs. Anyone know why?

Reply to this comment    10 December 2004, 22:56 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andree Chea  Account Info

>>but I have noticed that it skips certain loops in my basic programs

What kinds of loops?

Reply to this comment    12 December 2004, 00:45 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
anykey  Account Info
(Web Page)

Here's an example:
:While 1
:getkey -> G
:If G = 21: End
:End
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Reply to this comment    13 December 2004, 02:18 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
calkfreak83  Account Info
(Web Page)

That could be replaced with:

:Repeat getkey=21
:End

As for why it skips it, I have no idea, and it has never happened to me.

Reply to this comment    13 December 2004, 04:13 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
W Hibdon  Account Info
(Web Page)

if you use second to launch the program, then g will equal 21. To avoid this, you are going to need to call getkey before the loop. So you have getkey -> g then the loop, that way the que or whatever is empty.

-W-

Reply to this comment    14 December 2004, 00:54 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
W Hibdon  Account Info
(Web Page)

I believe that I was looking for the word queue

-W-

Reply to this comment    14 December 2004, 03:38 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
anykey  Account Info
(Web Page)

But Mirage doesn't use the variable 'g', right? And if it did, it would be 0 before the if statement got a hold of it.
Besides, it works fine when I run it outside Mirage.

Reply to this comment    14 December 2004, 23:14 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
burntfuse  Account Info

Mirage using or not using "g" has nothing to do with it. Of course it'll work fine outside of MirageOS, since you press enter to run the program, not 2nd! But if you do press 2nd to run it in MirageOS, as W Hibdon said, the keypress will "overflow" and skip the title screen or whatever. It's happened many times to me in my own programs before I put in a delay (or "key released" detection)...

Reply to this comment    15 December 2004, 00:01 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
anykey  Account Info
(Web Page)

It works. Thanks!

Reply to this comment    16 December 2004, 19:48 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Kaaiman Account Info

The first GetKey loop is ignored by MirageOS. You'd better put an extra Getkey at the beginning of the prog, like this:

:"This is an example v1.0 Beta
GetKey
Disp "What are you","waiting for?
Repeat K‚0
GetKey->K
End

So you could put a useless GetKey on the second line of your prog.

Reply to this comment    15 December 2004, 14:50 GMT


Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
DWedit  Account Info
(Web Page)

Lite8x is a joke compared to Pucrunch. I've tested it on a few programs, and each time pucrunch wins by a few kilobytes. Of course, I had a small sample size here...

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 03:04 GMT


Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Chris Oliver  Account Info

I probably wont be using CrunchyOS either because I dont want to screw up my brand spankin new 84+SE, even though 100,000 writes to the archive is a hell of a lot. I still feel that MirageOS is the best because it has so many more options and will prevent writeback to archived progs.

However I will be distributing CrunchyOS to all of my friends because they dont have an SE like I do! ;)

Reply to this comment    9 December 2004, 22:31 GMT

Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
DWedit  Account Info
(Web Page)

CrunchyOS does not writeback to programs, it creates small patch files instead.

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 01:52 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
hyperdude31 Account Info

I just wish it wouldnt create an AppVar for each program you run. Otherwise, the compression seems all right to me.

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 14:52 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Andy Janata  Account Info
(Web Page)

Why not? It's saving you quite a bit of space on your calculator.

Reply to this comment    11 December 2004, 17:18 GMT


Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Jason Malinowski  Account Info

Actually it's 100,000 erasures...which only occur during garbage collects.

Your calculator should be completly fine, don't worry. :-)

Reply to this comment    12 December 2004, 15:49 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
jvdthwip Account Info

I don't see what all the hubub about writing to the flash is all about...

With 100,000 erasures, even if you GarbageCollect an extremely generous amount of 10 times a day, it will take Twenty-Seven *YEARS* for the flash to wear out...

I'm also sure that by 2031, you will have backed up your calc, got a new calc, or replaced the flash due to old age...

Reply to this comment    13 December 2004, 01:52 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
Chris Oliver  Account Info

Point proven.

Yeah, when you think about it, its gonna take a long time to ruin the ROM, so i wont be worrying about that anymore. Thanx guys. (i am apparently fairly new to TI-calculators)

Reply to this comment    13 December 2004, 23:01 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: CrunchyOS v0.6 Released
CalcKing  Account Info

The main reason I disable write-back is to save battery power, since I have an SE it doesn't really
matter how often the flash is used. I use rechargeables, so if I use too much power at once
(Garbage collect anyone?) I will have to return home and charge the batteries before I can use the
rechargeable batteries again. I do carry a spare set, but I still prefer to limit how much I need to
use them. :-)

Reply to this comment    14 December 2004, 04:33 GMT

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