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TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Posted by Michael on 14 February 2003, 05:14 GMT

News has been slow lately, and these programs were added nine days ago, but it's worth mentioning that TIGCC v0.94 has been released. This version has numerous updates. Also, KerNO v2.3 is out. Gaining popularity recently, KerNO provides excellent features for nostub programs on the 89, such as crash protection and other housekeeping tasks.

 


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Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
gorion Account Info

Wow! A news item this late? Well, perhaps not too late in Arizona. Anyway, perhaps someday I will get a TI-89, or maybe Voyage 200, and then I could make good use of them.

Also, happy Valentine's Day! How did you all do on the AMC contests?

     14 February 2003, 06:01 GMT

Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
benryves  Account Info
(Web Page)

Someday... I'd like to get one too.

     14 February 2003, 09:15 GMT


Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

TI also makes a lot of APPS for the TI-89. Of course, there's also some good ones for the TI-83+se.

     15 February 2003, 17:45 GMT


H
slimey_limey  Account Info
(Web Page)

But they all cost money or are useless for me!

     16 February 2003, 02:17 GMT


Re: H
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

What about the Study Card APP? That's pretty handy.

     16 February 2003, 17:44 GMT


Re: Re: H
RCTParRoThEaD_  Account Info
(Web Page)

yeah, for storing notes and cheating =p

     16 February 2003, 20:20 GMT


Re: Re: Re: H
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

A plain text file could do that, in fact, you could even do that on a TI-82, just in a blank program.

     16 February 2003, 23:26 GMT

Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
KermMartian  Account Info
(Web Page)

I have always wondered how exactly Kerno works with the crash protection - does it run the program line by line looking for illegal calls, memory usage, etc.?

     14 February 2003, 14:21 GMT


Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Timendus  Account Info
(Web Page)

Good question. I think it does not, because that would slow programs down too much.

My guess would be that it is an interrupt, waiting for a specific keypress. When that key is pressed it clears the stack and returns to the OS. But that wouldn't keep program's from screwing up your memory...

Again: good question. Who knows the answer?

     14 February 2003, 15:54 GMT

Me!
slimey_limey  Account Info
(Web Page)

It puts it's crash handler address into the processor's crash vectors, so KerNO's code is only called when the processor encounters an error. You can use the same approach if you want to make your own crash-handling routine in your programs. (See the Motorola docs for more info.)

     14 February 2003, 16:52 GMT


-= Z80 =- ??
KermMartian  Account Info
(Web Page)

Would that be possible on a Z80 processor? How?

     14 February 2003, 17:41 GMT

Re: -= Z80 =- ??
q x  Account Info

Probably.; No clue.

     14 February 2003, 18:01 GMT

Re: -= Z80 =- ??
Gergely Patai  Account Info
(Web Page)

No way.

     14 February 2003, 19:07 GMT

Re: -= Z80 =- ??
nyall Account Info
(Web Page)

Does the z80 have interupts dedicated to error control? As far as I no it does not have a whole lot. The 68k does.

     14 February 2003, 20:00 GMT

Re: -= Z80 =- ??
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

I doubt it, but it would sure be handy for buggy games.

     14 February 2003, 21:52 GMT


Re: Re: -= Z80 =- ??
angelboy Account Info
(Web Page)

Like mine.

     15 February 2003, 15:35 GMT


Re: -= Z80 =- ??
Timendus  Account Info
(Web Page)

It doesn't have crash vectors (as far as I know), so no...

Too bad. It would have been usefull for saving my data about twice a week... :)

     15 February 2003, 18:07 GMT


Z80 crash protection
tge82  Account Info

Yeah, pretty much all you can do is install an interrupt handler that waits for some key and exits the program. Some shells do this. But programs that install their own interrupts (e.g. for grayscale) will disable the crash-protection interrupt handler. And even then, no crash protection will stop a program from corrupting the entire RAM. I've had a lot of ASM programs do that plenty of times.

     15 February 2003, 23:23 GMT

Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

You don' know what you are missing, not having an 89. I plan on getting a 92+, Much coller with the bigger screen.

     14 February 2003, 15:25 GMT


Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

My mistake, that would be cooler.

     14 February 2003, 15:30 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

I don't know, the TI-89 is allowed on SAT's and all of those tests. The TI-92+ isn't because of the QWERTY keyboard, which makes it more of a mini "computer" The TI-89 is sweet for keeping hidden notes and stuff, though. I keep all my classmate's usernames and passwords and stuff in there.

I could be wrong, but doesn't the TI-89 have more games than the 92+? The big screen is probably easier to read text off of. Oh, one more thing, isn't the resolution, well, the LCD better on the TI-89? On the TI-82 it's blue on green... isn't the TI-92+ screen kind of like that, instead of black on white?

     14 February 2003, 21:57 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

Thanks for the infomation. I had no idea the was the dingy color that I hate. And I figured that most of the games were the same. However, My friend has an 89, and it also has the bluish text with the greenish screen. But still thanks for the warning.

     15 February 2003, 00:48 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Kevin Kofler
(Web Page)

If you think the TI-89 is "blue on green", it is probably because you have never seen a TI-85 or a TI-92 (not the TI-92+ HW2, but the old TI-92, or the TI-92+ HW1 which is just a TI-92 with a Plus module).

     15 February 2003, 08:10 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

so if I were to buy a 92+ to day, the helpful coment that no_one posted would not be true? that would be nice if he were wrong. Not that I don't like him, just i really had my heart set on a 92+, and would hate it if it was a bad decision.

     16 February 2003, 00:22 GMT

Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
gorion Account Info

You should just buy a Voyage 200, although I have no idea what the screen on it looks like.

     16 February 2003, 04:44 GMT


Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
dietsche Account Info
(Web Page)

personally, i like my v200 better than my 92 plus. The resolution on the 92 plus/v200 is the same as the 89. The screen (v200/92p) is bigger than the 89, and has more pixels, but the quality/resolution/sharpness is the same. The pixels on the display are BLACK and the background can be described as a very light gray.

-Greg

     16 February 2003, 07:43 GMT


Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Alright, thanks. I didn't know how good the TI-92+ resolution was. Its resolution is better than the regular TI-92's resolution though, isn't it? I'm probably wrong again, but as long as someone knows, it's okay :)

     16 February 2003, 17:49 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Kevin Kofler
(Web Page)

>Its resolution is better than the regular TI-92's resolution though, isn't it?

The resolution isn't. The contrast is, though.

     16 February 2003, 20:35 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Err, that's what I meant. Sorry, I'm having a rough day ;-) I was talking about the "colors", the contrast... how it displays... I need extra sleep :)

     16 February 2003, 23:27 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Well, I'm pretty sure about the SAT part. Even so, I don't think it would be a bad calculator, even though the new v200 also might be something to look into. education.ti.com might have some information on this topic.

     16 February 2003, 17:47 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

I had heard that about ACT/SAT, but I was not sure. And I never said that I was getting rid of my 89. That thing has been the best thing I own. I was devistated when I had to replace it with a new one. (you can only get HW2 calcs now.) I will have it unti the day I retire from my future job as an engineer.

     17 February 2003, 00:08 GMT

Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
rmohr02 Account Info
(Web Page)

>>How did you all do on the AMC contests?

Too bad I don't get to take those anymore (I'm in college now), but last year I got a 112.5.

     14 February 2003, 16:10 GMT


Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
JcN  Account Info

What are AMC contests?

     14 February 2003, 20:39 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

LOL, I just asked the same question :) Apparently, not all of us know what they are, hehe.

     14 February 2003, 21:58 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Joey Gannon  Account Info
(Web Page)

Go to the link above to see the AMC website. It's a math contest that many schools put on. I won in my school last year. My math teacher kinda forgot this year, so I have to take the B form.

     15 February 2003, 00:50 GMT


Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Yay! A new news article! I was going to download KerNO a while back, but never got around to it. The article says it has anti-crash protection, which would be really nice. Is it made in C? Guess I'll download it and find out ;) (Hope I remember this time)

What's AMC? I feel dumb :)

     14 February 2003, 21:46 GMT

TIGCC
angelboy Account Info
(Web Page)

don't feel dumb. I don't know what it is either

     14 February 2003, 21:57 GMT


Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Kevin Kofler
(Web Page)

>The article says it has anti-crash protection, which would be really nice.
That's its main purpose.

>Is it made in C?
No, it is written in assembly.

     15 February 2003, 08:12 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Well, it's a good thing that people still know 68k ASM. It's a really tough, imo.

     15 February 2003, 18:22 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
nyall Account Info
(Web Page)

it's really easy, imh.

     15 February 2003, 20:09 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

It might be easy, but C is much more intuitive. the commands are self-explainatory. (should that be hyphenated?)

     16 February 2003, 00:16 GMT

Yes.
slimey_limey  Account Info
(Web Page)

You did it right, but, FYI, it is spelled self-explanatory. There is no "i".

     16 February 2003, 02:34 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
dietsche Account Info
(Web Page)

:) are you saying that movemem is easier to remember than move or movem ;)

ASM is fun!

-Greg

     16 February 2003, 07:47 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Kevin Kofler
(Web Page)

It doesn't seem so, since you got it wrong. :-)
It's memmove, not movemem. :-)

     16 February 2003, 10:47 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Maybe it's a good thing I didn't try to learn 68k that much. I'd just embarrass myself ;-)

     16 February 2003, 17:55 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
dietsche Account Info
(Web Page)

hrm, well, i guess its been awhile since i last used memmove in C :)

-Greg

     16 February 2003, 22:21 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

I never used it at all... does it literally move memory? If it's really so popular, maybe I should look into it some.

     16 February 2003, 23:29 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Really? I think it's kind of hard. Maybe that's because I didn't spend as much time with it as I did with z80. z80 wasn't too bad. It just took a while to get the hang of how the syntax worked and everything. The 68k was really different than z80, which scared me away from it a bit. It's probably because it seems like it has more commands (move.w... wtf?)

     16 February 2003, 17:54 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
nyall Account Info
(Web Page)

As far as assembly languages go 68k is the easiest to learn I have ever encountered. It is much harder for a newbie to pick up assembly for accumulator based processors than it is for the 68k, where all data registers can be used equally and all adress registers can be used equally, except for the stack pointer.

Also simple register/variable management is less likely to bite a newbie in 68k asm than with z80.

     16 February 2003, 18:06 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
no_one_2000_  Account Info
(Web Page)

Really? It's not that hard? I guess I just think z80 is easier because I spent a lot of time reading the tutorials over and over. I skimmed through the 68k one once. But, with C and all as a subsitute, I never really found the need for 68k asm, even know the programs would be smaller.

     16 February 2003, 23:32 GMT

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
Theycallmeyams  Account Info

68k would be useful to know for TSR's and such, but I never been able to find a tutorial for 68k, much less to be able to program an app. I was going to do a shell like the MirageOS for the 83+, but cannot fing a tutorial anywhere. I don't know what to do.

     17 February 2003, 00:13 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
RCTParRoThEaD_  Account Info
(Web Page)

TSRs can be made in C. goto Greg Dietsche's site. I think he has tutorials on TSR's in C

     17 February 2003, 02:57 GMT


Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: TIGCC 0.94 Updated; KerNO 2.3 Released
nyall Account Info
(Web Page)

I don't think most people have a good idea of size comparisons between asm and c code.

Here is one example:

if(*ptr == MUL_TAG) ptr--;

the assembly version of this one line will be 2 or 6 byte smaller than the c code. It depends on the size of branches use. tigcc will code this with two branches. in asm i would code it with one simple branch just to skip the subtraction.


-Samuel

     17 February 2003, 04:57 GMT

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